Would faking the Blizzard signed maps be more good or bad?

I see no backup proof that the save game triggers would work on multiplayer, other than that saving games works on bnet. Even if it did work on multiplayer, you have to remember that you would need the same people playing the same game to play it again. Also if you DO get it working, there still is the problem of the 'Delete Save Game' problem. Some game could delete other games saved files.

This would be good in singleplayer, but say NO to Multiplayer.

i think it would be nice for it to be enabled for multi, but its definitely too easy to abuse, however; single player could benefit greatly from it and it would be much harder to screw somones computer with it, personally i'm all for using it in singleplayer, but not multi. I still say Blizzard exxagurated what it could do though.

I think if they could do what ThePersonThing has said, and only keep a certain amount of save games, then it could easily be used safly for multi.

i just dont think it would work for multi, i mean its a nice idea, but i can just see people lagging out\disconnecting randomly when it does this.

Really, all I would like is the ability to switch between maps on multiplayer, use game caches, and such.

...I see no reason to blizzard sign a map to use fairly useless functions such as creating folders and save files.

By the way...

why did blizzard even include the Blizzard Signed Map Only trigs if you have no way of making it a blizzard signed map?

If you people were as smart as you should be, you wouldn't be arguing. You'd be exploring and exploiting previously suggested methods.

Why, exactly, do I deserve rude comments and flaming (and that was flaming). I have not been abusive, and I have not once been rude to ThePersonThing. I understand that changes could be made to stop the triggers being used, but 1) In there current state they easily can be and 2) Even if Blizzard implemented the suggested changes, people would complain that they were too 'stunted' by them and say that Blizzard should remove the limitations.

Very true. I would very much like to see it in Multiplayer and Singleplayer, but I would rather not have the features than have a Warcraft 3 map filling up my hard-drive with useless save-games. Enabling the triggers in Singleplayer would be a good idea, and it would cut down problems, but not stop them. It would be great to be able to build those features into your map, campaigns could be made alot better if they were available. But, remember, it would be possible for someone to make a Singleplayer map that abused the triggers and put it for DL here. I don't think downloadable maps are screened here (might be wrong), and as soon as someone played it and saw the virus they would report it, but thats still one computer damaged by the map. Even if the map was screened by mods/admins before it was put up for public DL, their computer would still be broken.

Even if they put in a limited number of saves per map, I can think of some 'creative' ways with which you could still abuse the triggers.

As it is, I'm just glad that the change-map part of the triggers works.

If it were done, a hardcoded limit of about 10 saves would be fine, unless you would like to share some of your "creative ways" with the rest of this forum? Who would need more than 10 maps?If you made them all big you can just use boundrys to insert shops and things on the same map without changing it.

And while that might of been rude, it was not flaming, he was not going out of his way to insult, or piss you off he just causuly mentioned the word ****ing, if you can not understand that any post that may mention a swear is not a flame prehaps you shouldn't be here in the first place.

You still haven't answered my question. Why did I deserve any rudeness?

Exactly what I was saying, if you cant use them, Bliz would of hidden them into the jass, instead of making them GUI.

Well, sticking to the less volatile topics at hand, I agree that it is very perplexing why Blizzard would leave in tiggers that they then expressly told us not to use, much like dangling a prize over our heads just out of reach and crying "Neener, neener, neener! You can't get it!" You know, in one of those annoying sing-song voices that older siblings and playground bullies use for taunting. Not that I would know as I am the eldest in my family. Though there's an interesting story to that...

Oh, right the topic at hand. Well, here are the possible reasons I can think of Blizzard would leave those triggers in:

1. To show us what COULD be possible, ostensibly in preparation for eventually opening the triggers, most likely after all the parts of the Orc Campaign are out and they've released a patch that both enables them and puts reasonable limits on them. Wishful thinking, to be sure, but it is a possibility. How crazy would it be if they suddenly added triggers to WE that they'd been using all along?
2. To taunt us, to try and see if we could break down the barriers that prevent us from using them. In this instance, hopefully they already have reasonable limits in place and just wanted to make it a challenge/keep anyone not clever enough to work around it out. This is, again, wishful thinking, and probably not likely given the question of why protect something if you want people to get at it? Once a few people know, knowledge is bound to leak out to others. Besides, Blizzard doesn't seem the type to taunt players. They're a rambunctious group, but they know when something's bad PR.
3. Most likely they had to be left in because the Orc Campaign uses these triggers. Due to the structure of WC3, it would cause no end of trouble to not have them listed. Blizzard knows we know the MPQ format and can extract and examine the campaign maps and knew it would drive us nuts if we couldn't open the Orc Campaign because WE couldn't find some of the triggers, especially given that the Orc Campaign was supposed to be the example of what TFT:WE could do. (Of course, it could be said that this is the same reason we are so annoyed that the "example of what TFT:WE can do" uses triggers we cannot, especially when it was one of the most integral and most pre-hyped features of the campaign that it would not be linear but feature movement from map to map where actions in one map can affect others, like an RPG.) And while it's true they could have just converted them to JASS, then people would have eventually looked at the JASS, seen the functions, copied them, and then gone nuts trying to understand why they didn't work. At least as a graphical trigger, Blizzard has a space to put up that "This will not work for you." warning.

So, that's about all I can figure for why the triggers are still there. Not sure which if any of them is correct, but my money's on the last one. The first two are too much wishful thinking, but the third one, while unglamorous, is pretty logical.

As for Wizerd, he has a pretty good point, I'd say. :p We're wasting enough time with meaningless argument. It's all a moot point unless someone comes up with a way to do it. And maybe the silence of some of the more prominent originators of this thread says something, ne? Anyway, I'm going to stop watching this thread, so I do hope no one else needs to contact me here. Either way, best of luck all around, ne? May those who deserve the power find it.

Well said Lost Loch, but:


They didn't have to be left in, they could have been disabled for use in the editor, which you said by "not have them listed". But I started a petition at Blizzard to have everything, even things that wouldn't make any extra advantages to us to be shown, or for us to have access to. Maybe we had this coming, they could have hid them entirely, and put them in a remote .J so we wouldn't know about them, but we said we wanted everything even if it didn't help us.

Maybe they took it too seriously, and gave us an awesome feature that we can't use?

Not being a frequenter of the Bnet forums, that's an interesting story I would not otherwise have known, and indeed a plausible explanation. Through your petition and other actions by the Warcraft 3 modding community, we have shown we want to have nothing hidden from us. We broke into MPQs and rewrote SLKs, all the while wishing for a WE that could help us instead of hindering us. We don't want to be "babied," and Blizzard was well known to have tried to take into account the desires of modders when designing the TFT WE. Not saying they got it perfect, (editable buffs and an MDX exporter come to mind) but they certainly listened to us. That's how we got the über-expanded Object Editor and the Import Manager and such. So it's entirely possible that, as you put it, they took us too seriously when we said we wanted everything, even when they didn't think it could help us.

after much thought and deliberation, i've come to the conclusion that They dont particulary want us to use the triggers, but they full well know what people can do with hacking and such and are probably fully aware that somone will hack into the game and get the triggers working, so i wouldnt be surprised if they put in safeguards of some kind, if they havnt then ovbiously i've been giving blizzard way too much credit. I think the triggers are there so that they can release them after the orc campaign or at some later point, probably with limitations. I dont think this is wishful thinking, because there is no other plausable reason to do it, blizzard arnt stupid and they arnt gonna put that kinda stuff in because somone started a petition to have everything visible, if they really really didnt want us to use them, they wouldnt have made them in the first place, i just think their holding them back to a later date, also on the single player map idea, how many people do you know who download random maps off the internet? I do know that most WCIII sites test the maps before they put them up for download so its unlikly any serious damage could be done by making them singleplayer only.