After Return of the King? New map coming out need suggestions and feedback.

Superpeon, i don't think you should continue with this map. It sounded fun to me, but the public thinks it's the worst thing since Dubya.

Or that movie "Torque".

I just dumped about $350 into my car, so all I'm left with is two cents:

An all-encompassing game about LOTR is impossible, because so much of the depth of the book lies in subject matter and character interplay. All you can do is take a piece of the work and expand on it, like EA Games did with "Return of the King" turning into one of the biggest hack-and-slash fests of all time.

Since Warcraft III is an RTS, the best thing you can do with it is make an RTS-based campaign. Take a page from the original Warcraft III campaigns.

As for extending the storyline, the big thing that there ISN'T in Tolkien's work is triviality. What I mean is that plots aren't recycled just to make room for more battles and elvish songs. The One Ring plot was the biggest thing of its time. Sauron had ultimate power and only through the destruction of the ring could he be undone. Coming back and saying, "Oh, hang on a second, his mace is ALSO all-powerfuL!!" is just trivial and does insult the value of the books. It's like what the Star Wars extended universe did with The Emperor, by saying he had an army of personal clones and his "spirit" floated to the center of the universe, etc, etc. . . .

The problem with extending the story is that there really was nothing in depth written about it. There's a rather lengthy timeline in the LOTR appendicies, but nothing detailed. Taking it upon yourself to bring in new characters, concepts, or recycle old beloved characters would require the skill of a great fantasy writer and a masterful command of the english language.

My suggestion would be to expound on the material that is already available. Instead of extending the storyline, do something with what has already been laid out. Make an RPG focused on Tom Bombadil, or make an RTS campaign based during the events in the Silmarillion with the fight against Morgoth.

The Silmarillion campaign would be my suggestion because you can utilize familiar locations and characters. There is already one in development, if I recall, but there's nothing to say that you can't create one yourself.

My best advice would be to:

a.) Create a campaign using the mythos of accepted Tolkien Lore.

b.) If you must create a campaign after LOTR, don't focus it on current characters, or character relations. (Like children or relatives.) Make some of your own and place them in Middle-Earth, possibly allowing them to interact with two or three famous characters like Aragorn, or Legolas (who sticks around Middle Earth for a while) The last thing anyone wants is to suddenly run into Elrond or Gandalf and have them say, "Oh, I forgot to mention that Sauron's mace is actually also an ultimate source of his power. Ooops."

Take it for what you will.

-Bejoty

Wow, Shadowfax. You gave excellent advice without belittling anyone. Good job. The Silmarrilion idea is good. I agree that it would be stupid to have Aragorn's son or something be the person, though it would be fun to meet one of the Fellowship along the way. SuperPeon, if you are absolutely decided on doing this, make it very carefully and thoughtfully, you don't want to insult Tolkien, make a crappy story, or wander away from the Middle Earth universe.

I suggest you continue with this, but again, make it the best you can think of.

i would think of if i made a lotr map about what happens after rotk to be more along the lines of something that doesnt tell people what happens but kinda suggests. like spaceballs is a spoof of starwars and its not insulting lucas. im not saying my will be a spoof on lotr im saying that if i do something that people know isnt real its not insulting. if space balls said that is something that happend during or around the time of starwars that would be an insult, and if i say that my map isnt the actual following of rotk then its not really insulting. like when a 10 year old tries to make a 100 dollar bill on his computer with normal paper. even though that is illigal no one will care because people can tell its not even close to a real 100 dollar bill. so as long as i make sure no one thinks im trying to make people beleave that what i do actually happens after ROTK it should be fine and its not insulting.

i dont even know if im going to make this because i am also trying to make a cool game where you start off and build deffences how u want and then u have people attack you. or some where along those lines. it will be simalar to midevil tatics.

Wow, you guys really can't take a joke. As poor in taste as that was, my point was that this is a stupid idea and it shouldn't be done.


I would say "yeah? everyone is entitled to their opinion against my piss-poor attempts at modding. mine happens to be as low as yours =P."

And who says EQ is a great game?

`s

Him, obviously.

If you know it was poor in taste, why do it? It just makes people think less of you...

I think we should call on the powers that be to close this thread, I smell the acrid scent of an approaching flame war...

EDIT: Ugh, where can I find a mod/admin?

I think SuperPeon should go to as much depth as he likes with his map idea.

Tolkien created an amazing world, simply said; and it seems kinda wasteful to let such a place as Middle-Earth go to "waste", so to speak (not that it isn't, mind you).

I mean, this topic has turned into a controversy over someone just wanting to tack on his own view of Tolkien's world. Let him at it if he likes, and I'd even be willing to help out if I wasn't too busy with my own projects.

Regardless, who cares if someone or everyone begins making spoofs, recreations and all that other stuff? The original still exists, and it will never change.. unless some kind of group ran by mothers decided the book was racist.

Well, er.. there's my 2 cents. o_O

Post-script: IMHO, I think this map's story would follow along the lines of 'what if'.

Exactly, Vandell. If it is so bad as to make Tolkein seem bad, then NO ONE WOULD PLAY IT, so it wouldn't make him seem bad at all.

all i wanted was some suggestions i didnt really want to make this a huge fight, (even though i find it amuzing).

*laughs*

Okay, peoples, sorry for my brooding sarcasm. I've changed my mind, go ahead and make an "after LOTR" campaign.

I'll just keep to myself and not download it. No harm will come of you... seriously... I mean it, serious. No harm whatsoever........*grin*

`s

didn't need to say u weren't gonna dl it...just gonna cause more tensions...
ppl, don't make anymore remarks w/ things that may make ppl upset...

I would side with sides here.

1- Whoever said making EQ into wc3 is futile is an idiot, we are actually quite far in making it.

2- Peon *is* a dumbass. He's trying to rip off the LOTR story and "mirror" it by making sauron's mace like the ring. This is rather retarded; a lotr after-story would be good but before making a SINGLE map based on a story, READ THE BOOK damnit! From what hes posted it seems hes some retard who either read like 1 page of it or never read it at all! Expanding Lotr should be something like The Hobbit was, minus starting the LOTR series, not EXACTLY what the book did.

3- Tech no need for threats.. -_-;;

The mace was but one possibility briefly touched upon. And Karuma, are you saying he shouldn't try and be creative, or play with WE? Even if it sucks, just don't play it.

Vandell, i was waiting for someone to say it like that:D
There is nothing wrong with doing what you want to do, SuperPeon. I know of a lot of people who would play this. there's nothing bad about being creative and curious , and thinking about what happened after Aragorn was crowned. I personallly thought it would be cool if Sauron somehow came back and they had to fight him...

Most of the people against this are being really defensive about this, saying that he hasn't read the book, or he is a dumbass for doing a single thing wrong. It's not that big of a deal if he doesn't have the astounding intellect that most of you claim to have.

About the mace thing, it's not that easy to expand on Tolkien's finely sealed books. You have to search for little unexplained things, and your job is to explain them. Then you are on the way to making something presentable. Good luck.