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Don't want control of the AI's units..

02-11-2006, 04:55 AM#1
corrupt
Is there anway to let the AI control his own units? Every time I play it says you've been given control of their units, exactly what I don't want. Let the AI handle his own army and you worry about your own!
At the very least, how about an option? For those of us that want his units, we take them, and those that want it more "human-like" (since no sane human would give you control of his guys) will let the AI handle his own guys.

Other than that, great map. Keep it up!
02-11-2006, 09:20 PM#2
Jacek
How did you accomplished that... you should give them to computer player normally, and then just ally computers with human players.
02-13-2006, 04:46 AM#3
corrupt
I just start a LAN game and add 11 computers (normal) and the 2 that are on my team as soon as the game starts it says you've been granted control of their units.
I think this is a feature rather than a bug, but I have to say, as fun as this map is I don't want control of my allies units. The AI doesn't even control them jointly with you anyway, doesn't pick heroes, etc..
The computer-only teams work pretty good, but the computers on your team, well, it mine as well be only you.

Also the AI doesn't seem to attack enemy bases, they all go out to the middle of the map and fight, but none actually come to attack bases. I send my hero out and the AI sends a few guys chasing him but as soon as they get "too close" to my base, they turn around and head back into the middle of the map again.

Panto EXCELLENT work on this map my friend! I'm glad to see you decided to support AI at all, when so many custom maps don't.
I just hope you'll take into consideration taking away this granting control of your computer allies units. Right now I'm just playing 1vs1vs1vs1 because it's too much of a chore to have to control my guys AND my allies guys. If a computer player is added, let them be fully autonomous, just like a human ally would be.

Thanks for a great map and here's to hoping something will be done about the shared unit control with AI problem.
02-13-2006, 04:48 AM#4
corrupt
In the features list:

"Computer players give control of their units to their allies"

That's what I was referring to. I'd love to see the computer control his own units instead, I have enough to worry about with just my own units, don't need to contrl theirs too.
At the very least, how about making it an option?
02-16-2006, 04:49 PM#5
Panto
I may implement a choice in a future release, but honestly, you're the first person to feel this way.

On the bright side, with the next release, all of the AI commands that computers use will be available for all players to call on, so controlling a player without really doing any work will become much easier.

As far as the AI only attacking the middle, that's intended. When I initially developed the AI, computers would attack player corners once they won control of the middle, but just having three AI players operating in unison was enough to take out even the best players' un-coordinated defenses. A future release may have the computer's decision-making tied to the "level" of the computer selected during the start-up screen (Easy, Normal, Insane).
03-02-2006, 12:09 PM#6
corrupt
Ouch, what a shame.

To me, AI is for filling in for a human player, so your AI allies giving up control of their guys to you as soon as the map starts sort of takes out any point of even having AI allies.
Got enough to worry about with just my own guys, I woudn't want control of a human ally's stuff anymore than I would the AI, let them control their own guys.
You should do a vote or somethong on it as I can't see how anybody would want to control 3 different players..

And the AI not attacking other players is probably the biggest disappointment. What's the point of even playing singleplayer if you're the only one who does the attacking?
That's good if the AI coordiantes attacks on other corners of the map, I mean isn't that what people do on footmen wars anyway? I know whenever I play on bnet me and my allies *always* go after the same corner of the map together. But imagine everyone just sending all their guys to the middle of the map and never attacking. The map would never end that way.

You did a good job, but IMO, you've got to let the AI attack other players or else it really defeats the whole purpose of being able to add computer plaeyrs at all if all they do is move whatever they make to the middle of the map and never attack.
03-02-2006, 06:14 PM#7
Panto
Allow me to explain where I think you're diverging from the AI's intended purpose.

The AI is meant to fill in teams so that people playing online can have a full house without getting all the players necessary. Your purpose is to have a full game while playing solo.

As such, when the early AI teams, which did attack corners, proved so devastating to human-controlled teams through sheer coordination, they made it un-fun. People wanted them to be a presence and an influence, but not a dominating force.

Similarly, do not think of your computer-slot teammates as "AI controlled", because they are not. They are, in fact, a result of the fact that I did not want players who left the game to be destroyed, as is the standard in most Footwar-style maps. While my original solution, again, was what you're suggesting now, there simply is no way that an AI force can rival the intelligence of a human, and humans don't like it when the AI player starts deciding where to attack and they have to either follow along or allow the AI to hang itself. Thus, the leavers (and computer teammates) simply relinquish control.

Now, the good news.

All of the tactical AI options are available to the players in the next release. Whereas an AI will test parameters to decide what to do and then implement a solution, now you will be able to decide on a solution and implement it yourself with as much ease, using the Tactical menu available on all the heroes. Thus, if you must play solo and must have a team of 3, you'll be able to coordinate your AI allies simply by cycling to their heroes with F2 and F3 and using the tactical menu to choose a solution that best matches your own team's goal.

Secondly, AI difficulty has already been implemented for the next release, meaning that the Easy, Normal, and Insane difficulties of computer players will influence their choices. Easy computers defend their base only. Normal computers attack the center. Insane computers make priorities about enemies to attack and, when opportunity comes, attack them in force. Also, a mixture of computers on a team each follow their own AI and thus a lot of flexibility will be available on how you want your enemies to act.

These changes are already fully implemented, so you're basically just waiting for the next release, which will come along any time that I finish the rest of the updates.